Comments on: Some Thoughts on Coal to Diesel http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/ The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics Sun, 08 Nov 2009 12:18:00 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: california home investor http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-40940 california home investor Wed, 22 Apr 2009 21:00:22 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-40940 I was wondering if you could set up some sort of system so when your publish a new article, i get emailed to alert me? [JR: Done! Try <a href="http://twitter.com/climateprogress" rel="nofollow">http://twitter.com/climateprogress</a>] I was wondering if you could set up some sort of system so when your publish a new article, i get emailed to alert me?

[JR: Done! Try http://twitter.com/climateprogress]

]]> By: boya http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-31255 boya Tue, 03 Mar 2009 05:46:57 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-31255 You are posting nonsense. Your CTL would destroy our atmosphere and cause trillions of dollars of damage. You are posting nonsense. Your CTL would destroy our atmosphere and cause trillions of dollars of damage.

]]> By: Underground Coal Gasification http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-28536 Underground Coal Gasification Thu, 29 Jan 2009 12:49:21 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-28536 The thoughts provided by you is great very impressive article. The thoughts provided by you is great very impressive article.

]]> By: Diesel to liquids http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-28229 Diesel to liquids Tue, 27 Jan 2009 10:27:04 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-28229 Your post will definitely help those who cannot decide which one to buy. This will help them to know how a diesel engine & gasoline engines will work. Your post will definitely help those who cannot decide which one to buy. This will help them to know how a diesel engine & gasoline engines will work.

]]> By: Earl Killian http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15966 Earl Killian Sun, 13 Jul 2008 14:17:18 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15966 Kim, yes that works in a greenhouse because plants are given an abundance of everything else they need, such as water, sunlight, nutrients, and the temperature is controlled. The effect I mentioned above is a longer term effect: CO2 causes temperature to rise, and the plants need to spend more energy reducing their moisture loss, and thus less energy growing. Also, field experiments with increased CO2 have not had the same effects as in greenhouses because if you have more CO2, you also need more water and more nutrients in the soil to increase growth. There is actually one variant of what you propose in active development for using CO2 from the exhaust of fossil plants to grow algae: http://www.greenfuelonline.com/ Unfortunately this is not a sustainable model. Kim, yes that works in a greenhouse because plants are given an abundance of everything else they need, such as water, sunlight, nutrients, and the temperature is controlled.

The effect I mentioned above is a longer term effect: CO2 causes temperature to rise, and the plants need to spend more energy reducing their moisture loss, and thus less energy growing.

Also, field experiments with increased CO2 have not had the same effects as in greenhouses because if you have more CO2, you also need more water and more nutrients in the soil to increase growth.

There is actually one variant of what you propose in active development for using CO2 from the exhaust of fossil plants to grow algae:
http://www.greenfuelonline.com/
Unfortunately this is not a sustainable model.

]]> By: Kim Williams http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15964 Kim Williams Sun, 13 Jul 2008 06:05:14 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15964 Earl, just looked up CO2 on wikipedia and found that many greenhouse operators do indeed introduce extra CO2 into that indoor environment and find growth enhanced by as much as 50%. They find that indoors, the levels fall below 200 ppm so they bring it up to about 1000 ppm. Also, though I realize that there are many other factors involved, I know that crop yields are significantly higher than they were 40 years ago in the area where I live. Earl, just looked up CO2 on wikipedia and found that many greenhouse operators do indeed introduce extra CO2 into that indoor environment and find growth enhanced by as much as 50%. They find that indoors, the levels fall below 200 ppm so they bring it up to about 1000 ppm. Also, though I realize that there are many other factors involved, I know that crop yields are significantly higher than they were 40 years ago in the area where I live.

]]> By: Earl Killian http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15913 Earl Killian Sat, 12 Jul 2008 13:40:37 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15913 JR, CO2 is a greenhouse gas. 19th century physics showed that. I guess you are stuck in the 18th century? As for other planets warming, please see http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php #20 and #1 Kim, the natural level of CO2 over the last million years has been 180-280 ppm. That is the range that modern plants are adapted to. The level is now 385 ppm and rising at 2 ppm per year. Excess heat caused by CO2 is bad for many plants; for example higher nighttime temperatures decrease rice yields. JR, CO2 is a greenhouse gas. 19th century physics showed that. I guess you are stuck in the 18th century? As for other planets warming, please see
http://www.skepticalscience.com/argument.php
#20 and #1

Kim, the natural level of CO2 over the last million years has been 180-280 ppm. That is the range that modern plants are adapted to. The level is now 385 ppm and rising at 2 ppm per year. Excess heat caused by CO2 is bad for many plants; for example higher nighttime temperatures decrease rice yields.

]]> By: Kim Williams http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15898 Kim Williams Sat, 12 Jul 2008 03:42:58 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15898 JR has a point. CO2 is essential to plant life. I knew that in grade school, and the content of CO2 in the atmosphere is well under 1%. I would assume that someone, somewhere has attempted to enhance plant growth by introducing extra CO2 in a controlled environment. Would it work? Would this be a good way to use some of that EVIL stuff? Could any of the whiners who can't seem to think past the end of their noses, maybe find a way to take advantage of the situation rather than just accept the "worst case scenario", "doom and gloom" conclusion. JR has a point. CO2 is essential to plant life. I knew that in grade school, and the content of CO2 in the atmosphere is well under 1%. I would assume that someone, somewhere has attempted to enhance plant growth by introducing extra CO2 in a controlled environment. Would it work? Would this be a good way to use some of that EVIL stuff? Could any of the whiners who can’t seem to think past the end of their noses, maybe find a way to take advantage of the situation rather than just accept the “worst case scenario”, “doom and gloom” conclusion.

]]> By: Earl Killian http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15435 Earl Killian Fri, 04 Jul 2008 19:54:00 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15435 E.M. Smith, you ignore the fact that the existing fleet of 238 million cars and light trucks need to be replaced over the next 15 years anyway. You are posting nonsense. Your CTL would destroy our atmosphere and cause trillions of dollars of damage. E.M. Smith, you ignore the fact that the existing fleet of 238 million cars and light trucks need to be replaced over the next 15 years anyway. You are posting nonsense. Your CTL would destroy our atmosphere and cause trillions of dollars of damage.

]]> By: E.M.Smith http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15406 E.M.Smith Fri, 04 Jul 2008 02:55:19 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2006/10/18/some-thoughts-on-coal-to-diesel/#comment-15406 A back of the spreadsheet calculation: Using the numbers above, a total replacement of the U.S. oil supply via CTL would take $1 1/2 Trillion. I know, we don't need to replace it all, but it's a nice number to use for comparisons. Replacing 300 million cars with new ones at $20,000 each would cost $6 Trillion. Hmmm... And that ignores the fact that lots of those cars will cost much more than $20g's and completely ignores all the airplanes, trains, busses, trucks, ships, 'copters, et.al. Call it $12 Trillion for a full sweep. So CTL runs out at about 1/8 th the cost of fleet replacement... Hmm... so much for all those $Billions... And Montana could use the CTL plants to turn switchgrass into Diesel and still be green... A back of the spreadsheet calculation:

Using the numbers above, a total replacement of the U.S. oil supply via CTL would take $1 1/2 Trillion. I know, we don’t need to replace it all, but it’s a nice number to use for comparisons. Replacing 300 million cars with new ones at $20,000 each would cost $6 Trillion. Hmmm… And that ignores the fact that lots of those cars will cost much more than $20g’s and completely ignores all the airplanes, trains, busses, trucks, ships, ‘copters, et.al. Call it $12 Trillion for a full sweep.

So CTL runs out at about 1/8 th the cost of fleet replacement… Hmm… so much for all those $Billions… And Montana could use the CTL plants to turn switchgrass into Diesel and still be green…

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