Comments on: Chapter Six Excerpt: The Technology Trap and the American Way of Life http://climateprogress.org/2008/01/15/chapter-six-excerpt-the-technology-trap-and-the-american-way-of-life-2/ The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics Fri, 22 Aug 2008 03:22:22 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.1 By: Paul K http://climateprogress.org/2008/01/15/chapter-six-excerpt-the-technology-trap-and-the-american-way-of-life-2/#comment-8090 Paul K Wed, 16 Jan 2008 02:08:18 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/01/15/chapter-six-excerpt-the-technology-trap-and-the-american-way-of-life-2/#comment-8090 Where is the line between current and breakthrough technology? To me, until technology is applied, it is still in the breakthrough category, e.g. plug in hybrids. The main impediment to wide use of wind and solar, the best current technologies, is the high initial cost vs. savings over time. Since most people move every 8 to 12 years, it is hard to justify an investment that takes 15 to 20 years to break even. Here in Illinois, construction will soon start on a clean coal/sequester demonstration power plant funded in large part by the Dept of Energy. Where is the line between current and breakthrough technology? To me, until technology is applied, it is still in the breakthrough category, e.g. plug in hybrids. The main impediment to wide use of wind and solar, the best current technologies, is the high initial cost vs. savings over time. Since most people move every 8 to 12 years, it is hard to justify an investment that takes 15 to 20 years to break even. Here in Illinois, construction will soon start on a clean coal/sequester demonstration power plant funded in large part by the Dept of Energy.

]]> By: Jay Alt http://climateprogress.org/2008/01/15/chapter-six-excerpt-the-technology-trap-and-the-american-way-of-life-2/#comment-8103 Jay Alt Wed, 16 Jan 2008 15:59:09 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/01/15/chapter-six-excerpt-the-technology-trap-and-the-american-way-of-life-2/#comment-8103 One huge difference between FutureGen and 'breakthru' projects like the elusive hydrogen car is that each component of FutureGen is already engineered and exists. And they are all being used in various industrial processes. The key reason to build FutureGen is to work out the bugs of combining the power generation island with the gasifier, air separation and scrubber islands. Utilitites and manufacturers must gain operating experience and so find out what the overall efficiency and availabilities of the system will be. The only way to do that (and pin down costs) is to build an actual demonstration plant. On the day the Alliance picked IL for the plant, DOE said they might not fund it because of cost inflation. Since then, they've floated ideas that the 'research' project could be divided up into small parts. That is garbage. It is not a research project or a prototype. It is a demonstration project of a complex system. Breaking the system up into components would be a foolish waste of money that would never generated the knowledge needed to run such a plant. One huge difference between FutureGen and ‘breakthru’ projects like the elusive hydrogen car is that each component of FutureGen is already engineered and exists. And they are all being used in various industrial processes. The key reason to build FutureGen is to work out the bugs of combining the power generation island with the gasifier, air separation and scrubber islands. Utilitites and manufacturers must gain operating experience and so find out what the overall efficiency and availabilities of the system will be. The only way to do that (and pin down costs) is to build an actual demonstration plant.

On the day the Alliance picked IL for the plant, DOE said they might not fund it because of cost inflation. Since then, they’ve floated ideas that the ‘research’ project could be divided up into small parts. That is garbage. It is not a research project or a prototype. It is a demonstration project of a complex system. Breaking the system up into components would be a foolish waste of money that would never generated the knowledge needed to run such a plant.

]]> By: Paul K http://climateprogress.org/2008/01/15/chapter-six-excerpt-the-technology-trap-and-the-american-way-of-life-2/#comment-8120 Paul K Wed, 16 Jan 2008 22:59:08 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/01/15/chapter-six-excerpt-the-technology-trap-and-the-american-way-of-life-2/#comment-8120 I don't know much about this beyond the announcement press reports. The DOE dissembling is not good news. Is there a way to bring popular pressure to get the project built to original specifications? I don’t know much about this beyond the announcement press reports. The DOE dissembling is not good news. Is there a way to bring popular pressure to get the project built to original specifications?

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