Comments on: Toyota kidnaps one more electric car

By: patrick

patrick — Wed, 27 Feb 2008 20:59:13 +0000

Some similarities between the oil industry and the tobacco industry: They both exploit people’s addictions (nicotine in tobacco, the convenience of gas). Also, both industries have stifled better alternatives (not smoking is healthier than smoking, not using gas pollutes less). People have successfully resisted tobacco companies…

By: Beauchert fan

Beauchert fan — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 10:22:25 +0000

I know Kent Beaucherts’ (AKA Kermit Beauhrt) comments can be a little harsh and sometimes he follows up his cantankerous comments with more cantankerous comments under a different name but please don’t delete them. They are a source of great amusement to some. You can learn more about the postings of Mssr.Beauchert here. http://www.teslamotorsclub.com/ off-topic/ 672-ken-kent-kerry-beauchrt-beuchert-beuchrt-biker-rider-krider.html
Or, just stick his name(s) in quotations and google away.

By: Joe

Joe — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 02:37:07 +0000

I see that Tom and Kermit are the same person.
My apologies for not noticing sooner.
I have deleted both comments.

By: Paul Scott

Paul Scott — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 02:34:45 +0000

Kermit and Tom are the same person. It takes a pretty immature and uninformed person to write such tripe, and then to respond to his own manure. Oh well, the enemies of EVs have been guilty of much worse. I figure this bozo is a freelancer, though, since the industry guys hire people who can at least spell.

For the record – Kermit – I’ve been driving a RAV for over 5 years like Earl, and there has been zero maintenance, just like its zero pollution.

It’s the only car I’ve driven for half a decade and I’ve driven all over LA, Orange, San Diego and Ventura Counties. That’s a pretty good range for a car with a proprietary charging infrastructure!

All the new EVs will be able to charge from any 110 or 220 plug, greatly expanding the range.

If you don’t like the pollution from the electricity you use, why are you still using dirty power? You have a choice to get power from solar or wind, so do so and all of your driving in an EV will be 100% pollution-free.

By: Marc Geller

Marc Geller — Thu, 07 Feb 2008 02:20:17 +0000

I don’t know where the venom of Kermit Beauhrt and Tom C Gray comes from, but they embarrass themselves with the ignorance they parade as facts. I invite both to the take a ride in my well over 5 year old 2002 RAV4 EV. It has 57,000 miles on the original battery pack and still has the original range of well over 100 miles per charge. It is my only car, and has proven to be more reliable than the gas cars I have owned in the past.

By: Earl Killian

Earl Killian — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 23:06:59 +0000

For the record, let me say that our family has a 2002 RAV4-EV in the garage, and it is a great vehicle, so unlike some other posters, I have first-hand knowledge of what I am talking about. We have 76,000 miles on the original battery pack and it is still going strong (that’s just one data point, but it is a point consistent with plenty of real data). I consider the suggestion that NiMH batteries need to be replaced every 5 years quite silly.

I also was on the EV-1 waiting list (the one GM doesn’t like to admit) for a long time before getting a letter saying there were no more to lease. The EV-1 would have satisfied my needs as well.

No one said the RAV4-EV and EV-1 would have satisfied everyone’s needs (what two vehicles would?). The point is that they would have satisfied a great many people’s, and that would have made a difference.

By: John Mashey

John Mashey — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 20:46:06 +0000

Kermit (& Tom) (assuming one isn’t a sock-puppet, the writing style is pretty similar):

I assume you haven’t owned, say a RAV4EV, whose story in Wikipedia seems reasonably accurate, including the battery issues. I haven’t owned one either, but maybe people who do can comment knowledgably. I’ve driven an EV1, and it wouldn’t have been practical for me, but it sure was fun. I tried to drive an electric SMART in Palo Alto, but there were too many people ahead of me in the line to try it.

I don’t know what car companies’ motivations are in this, but I suspect at least some of this is avoiding Osborne Effect. In particular, it is a bad idea to talk very much about something if a) You can’t deliver many of them, due to supply constraints b) You can’t deliver it yet, and customers wait. Cars are at least somewhat like computers, especially in the old days: customers expected vendors to support products for a long time, including spares.

One can hope that the Toyota 1/X concept car actually turns into a real product sometime, and that people pick up on the Trinity AVS work.

Pure gasoline-powered *cars* will slowly be going the way of the dodo in favor of EV and PHEV… at least for anyone who isn’t wealthy. Peak Oil is here or coming soon, and even if it weren’t, there are some areas (like Los Angeles, CA Central valley especially) that need to be *burning* less, whether it’s gas, diesel, ethanol, biodiesel.

By: Tom C Gray

Tom C Gray — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 18:26:44 +0000

Sorghum Crow doesn’t know what he’s talking about. The major failed
waranty companents are ELECTRICAL (as Beauhrt noted correctly) not associated with the gas powertrain, which typically carries a 100,000 mile warranty. Crow is either a fool or lying thru his teeth.
Anyone who claims that electric cars are viable alternatives, should be forced to own one. They are nothing more than a gigantic headache and of no little value. They simply cannot replace a gas car, as even dimwitted 7 year olds easily can understand. And the batteries cost a small fortune, a point avoided by those shysters claiming that “it only costs pennies” to operate. There are obviously plenty of deceiving shills posting on this blog. An they aren’t even plausible in their arguments – the idea that a company would spend billions to build a car so they could destroy it (and accomplish what?) is so bizarre I am starting to reconsider the possibility that we have been visited by aliens. Really stupid aliens. Really, really stupid aliens.

By: Kermit Beauhrt

Kermit Beauhrt — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 18:17:30 +0000

I laugh at the total imbecilility of believing that the crappy and impractical 1990’s EVs are seen as viable alternatives to a gas car, or that the automakers would spend billions to develop them (and new technologies like regenerative braking, which is still a major enhancement of Evs) jus so they could destroy the vehicles.Another big stupid idea is that all the automakers were braindead and couldn’t see that the EV-1 (named by Tiem recently as one of the worst cars ever built) and Rav4 were totally impractically, exorbitantly expensive (the EV-1 cost three times more than
a Honda Accord and needed $20,000 every 5 years to replace the battery pack of 26 NiMH cells, weighing 1200 pounds(!). Only those naiive and gullible fools who swallowed the preposterously illogical arguments of that crockumentary “Who Killed ..” would believe that all of the dozen major automakers would want to avoid a “new” (right!! – the Detroit Electric of 1907 was pretty much every bit as good as the EV-1) tehnology.
Do the math using DOT stats and you’ll see that the Chevy VOLT can accomplish everything (and more) the EV-1 ever could in terms of
avoiding gasoline and carbon emissions, especially while runningon ethanol, which is almost always cleaner than grid-supplied electricity.
Only a dimwitted seven year old would buy the baloney that people need to spens over $43,000 for a car (the EV-1) that couldn’t reliably get to a destination over 40 miles away (and don’t get lost, or have to detour, or use the AC too much) , took 8 hours to recharge, required $20,000 worth of batteries every 5 years (the new Tesla battery pack costs $30,000, and
also lasts about 5 years, whether you drive the car or not). Anyone who shills for these poor quality EV makers should be required to own and drive one. I can’t think of a better punishment, although it might be considered cruel and usual to force someone to drive a battery-only EV.
I love the ignorance of those who think that a battery EV will have low maintenance and be more reliable than a gas car. Where are they living? on Mars? Most auto problems have nothing to do with the power drivetrain. They involve accessories THAT ARE ALMOST ALWAYS POWERED BY ELECTRICTY. And automakers don’t make money by building unreliable cars, as this fool claims. Warranty claims, to the contrary , are the biggest negative on a companies corporate profits.
And after the warranty, the owners vitually NEVER go to a dealership for repairs. Sorghum Crow, in other words, is a lying bastard.

By: Sorghum Crow

Sorghum Crow — Wed, 06 Feb 2008 15:47:32 +0000

Free press, even bad, is still free press.

I think Toyota should be hunting down and publicizing the RAV4-EVs that are out there.

But, As Mr. Killian notes above, a durable, low-maintenance automobile is not in the best interest of the company (in terms of growth and the bottom line). Bastards.