Comments on: Will McCain’s cynical lies destroy the chance for serious energy and climate policy? http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/ The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics Sun, 21 Mar 2010 02:41:15 -0400 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Dave Tonnes http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-49958 Dave Tonnes Mon, 11 May 2009 18:55:09 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-49958 The author also recommends that you read: The author also recommends that you read:

]]> By: Jingo http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17585 Jingo Wed, 13 Aug 2008 03:55:38 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17585 McCain is truly a man with vision. We cannot afford to conserve. Americans should burn through oil as quickly as possible. Meanwhile, the oil companies will get cheap drilling leases in protected areas and sit on them like they do with the majority of their current leases. Soon, the rest of the world will run out of oil and the United States will become the new Saudi Arabia - hopefully without the bans on playing music, public dancing, movie theaters and alcoholic beverages. Sure, the big oil companies will benefit most, raking in trillions in profits, but I'm sure they'll share it with the rest of us. McCain is truly a man with vision. We cannot afford to conserve. Americans should burn through oil as quickly as possible. Meanwhile, the oil companies will get cheap drilling leases in protected areas and sit on them like they do with the majority of their current leases.

Soon, the rest of the world will run out of oil and the United States will become the new Saudi Arabia – hopefully without the bans on playing music, public dancing, movie theaters and alcoholic beverages. Sure, the big oil companies will benefit most, raking in trillions in profits, but I’m sure they’ll share it with the rest of us.

]]> By: Cyril R. http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17305 Cyril R. Wed, 06 Aug 2008 15:56:01 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17305 I don't understand conservatives in the first place. What's so great about our current state of affairs that needs to be 'conserved'? Addiction to wasteful lifestyles and oil? Arrogance to think we can do anything we want and get away with it? Anti-patriotism? (like buying a foreign car and filling it up with foreign oil)? The monolithic investment in military, destabilizing other economic sectors? Seriously. I don’t understand conservatives in the first place. What’s so great about our current state of affairs that needs to be ‘conserved’? Addiction to wasteful lifestyles and oil? Arrogance to think we can do anything we want and get away with it? Anti-patriotism? (like buying a foreign car and filling it up with foreign oil)? The monolithic investment in military, destabilizing other economic sectors?

Seriously.

]]> By: Ryan http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17291 Ryan Wed, 06 Aug 2008 13:42:56 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17291 Chris, I suggest you read some of the posts on this blog. They will show you that you are wrong about efficiency not being enough to offset offshore oil (i.e. inflating your tires, read "DOE/EPA say Obama’s right, Limbaugh’s wrong: More oil can be found in your car than offshore"), and that nuclear is not the best option (read "The Self-Limiting Future of Nuclear Power"). On a side note, does anyone else find it odd that conservatives love nuclear power? Why is it their energy source of choice? It requires tons of government funding (last time I checked, conservatives liked smaller government). They point to France, but French nuclear power is run by a centralized, government run energy company... sounds like socialism to me. Chris, I suggest you read some of the posts on this blog. They will show you that you are wrong about efficiency not being enough to offset offshore oil (i.e. inflating your tires, read “DOE/EPA say Obama’s right, Limbaugh’s wrong: More oil can be found in your car than offshore”), and that nuclear is not the best option (read “The Self-Limiting Future of Nuclear Power”).

On a side note, does anyone else find it odd that conservatives love nuclear power? Why is it their energy source of choice? It requires tons of government funding (last time I checked, conservatives liked smaller government). They point to France, but French nuclear power is run by a centralized, government run energy company… sounds like socialism to me.

]]> By: Cyril R. http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17280 Cyril R. Wed, 06 Aug 2008 07:41:06 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17280 Bush, for example, tells us we're dangerously addicted to oil. What does he do about it? Next to nothing considering the scale of the problem. He's all talk when action is required, and all action (cough*Iraq*cough) when what's really needed is debate. Not the traits of a true leader. Bush, for example, tells us we’re dangerously addicted to oil. What does he do about it? Next to nothing considering the scale of the problem. He’s all talk when action is required, and all action (cough*Iraq*cough) when what’s really needed is debate. Not the traits of a true leader.

]]> By: Cyril R. http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17279 Cyril R. Wed, 06 Aug 2008 07:38:17 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17279 Chris, you don't understand the criterion of oppertunity costs. Drilling for expensive oil has bigger oppertunity costs than most efficiency measures. Thus, it would be absurd for the government to provide more incentives to drilling than to efficiency. Private investors must do what they want. It's a free country after all. But the govt hast to justify it's budget rationally. The fact that it is not doing this now means it deserves far greater attention in the future. You also omit other simple conservation and efficiency measures, it's not just about inflating tires. What's more, drilling for oil is like giving a junky more drugs. You need to give the junky less drugs and tell him to stop this absurd addiction. The president that can do that is one that can truly lead. McCain has political qualities, but he is no leader. Same for Bush. He's got qualities, but should have been kept away from the white house. Chris, you don’t understand the criterion of oppertunity costs. Drilling for expensive oil has bigger oppertunity costs than most efficiency measures. Thus, it would be absurd for the government to provide more incentives to drilling than to efficiency. Private investors must do what they want. It’s a free country after all. But the govt hast to justify it’s budget rationally. The fact that it is not doing this now means it deserves far greater attention in the future.

You also omit other simple conservation and efficiency measures, it’s not just about inflating tires.

What’s more, drilling for oil is like giving a junky more drugs. You need to give the junky less drugs and tell him to stop this absurd addiction. The president that can do that is one that can truly lead. McCain has political qualities, but he is no leader. Same for Bush. He’s got qualities, but should have been kept away from the white house.

]]> By: Chris http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17275 Chris Wed, 06 Aug 2008 03:57:34 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17275 I like how you didn't mention that Obama said that inflating tires will offset any oil that we can drill out of off-shore wells, which has completely been proven false by even optimistic analysis. I also like how you totally left out McCain's response that said that we SHOULD inflate our tires and other conservation methods because that would help, although it is far from a fix. He said we should ALSO drill, invest in alternative resources and technologies and build nuclear power plants (which is probably by far the best way at achieving energy independence). But cherry-picking a tiny soundbite that fits your agenda works better for you though. Don't let accuracy and honesty into your debate when it is more fun to smear your "enemy" should be your motto for this website. I like how you didn’t mention that Obama said that inflating tires will offset any oil that we can drill out of off-shore wells, which has completely been proven false by even optimistic analysis.

I also like how you totally left out McCain’s response that said that we SHOULD inflate our tires and other conservation methods because that would help, although it is far from a fix. He said we should ALSO drill, invest in alternative resources and technologies and build nuclear power plants (which is probably by far the best way at achieving energy independence).

But cherry-picking a tiny soundbite that fits your agenda works better for you though. Don’t let accuracy and honesty into your debate when it is more fun to smear your “enemy” should be your motto for this website.

]]> By: Sean http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17258 Sean Tue, 05 Aug 2008 23:26:12 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17258 McCain's emphasis on pleasing the oil companies and disparaging conservation is truly outrageous but fully consistent with the Bush administration's approach. Remember that when oilman Cheney drafted the Bush energy bill in secret? He met with renewable-energy folks once and oil and gas executives 40 times McCain voted for the bill despite the fact that the Washington Post described it as "a piñata of perks" for the oil companies and Public Citizen called it "The Best Energy Bill Corporations Could Buy". Obama naturally opposed it. And Obama gives energy conservation the respect it deserves. As he said in Houston, "In the face of climate change and other serious challenges, energy conservation is no longer just a moral luxury or a personal virtue. Conservation serves a critical national goal." Amen! McCain’s emphasis on pleasing the oil companies and disparaging conservation is truly outrageous but fully consistent with the Bush administration’s approach.

Remember that when oilman Cheney drafted the Bush energy bill in secret? He met with renewable-energy folks once and oil and gas executives 40 times

McCain voted for the bill despite the fact that the Washington Post described it as “a piñata of perks” for the oil companies and Public Citizen called it “The Best Energy Bill Corporations Could Buy”.

Obama naturally opposed it. And Obama gives energy conservation the respect it deserves. As he said in Houston,

“In the face of climate change and other serious challenges, energy conservation is no longer just a moral luxury or a personal virtue. Conservation serves a critical national goal.”

Amen!

]]> By: paulm http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17252 paulm Tue, 05 Aug 2008 22:21:52 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17252 This is all a ploy by big oil to drive the price of oil down temporarily, so that they can reinvest in it, reaping huge profits when the prices shoots back up, as everyone realizes whats going on - that were still running out of oil. This is all a ploy by big oil to drive the price of oil down temporarily, so that they can reinvest in it, reaping huge profits when the prices shoots back up, as everyone realizes whats going on – that were still running out of oil.

]]> By: Dennis http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17236 Dennis Tue, 05 Aug 2008 16:17:23 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/08/05/will-mccains-cynical-lies-destroy-the-chance-for-serious-energy-and-climate-policy/#comment-17236 The sad fact is that energy policy, like most discussions of scientific issues, cannot be discussed accurately by sound bites. McCain is saying there's oil under the sea (true) so if we drill we will pump more oil (true). But the details behind the data (how long, how much, at what price) are totally left out. Not to mention the fact that we got into our current energy and environmental mess by relying on oil. So when you say we "must speak up" about "peak oil and catastrophic climate change" I ask: how? How do we do that and get the full truth across in sound bites during an election campaign? The sad fact is that energy policy, like most discussions of scientific issues, cannot be discussed accurately by sound bites. McCain is saying there’s oil under the sea (true) so if we drill we will pump more oil (true). But the details behind the data (how long, how much, at what price) are totally left out. Not to mention the fact that we got into our current energy and environmental mess by relying on oil. So when you say we “must speak up” about “peak oil and catastrophic climate change” I ask: how? How do we do that and get the full truth across in sound bites during an election campaign?

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