Comments on: Must-read IEA report explains what must be done to avoid 6°C warming http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/ The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics Sun, 08 Nov 2009 08:19:29 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: msn nickleri http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-26419 msn nickleri Wed, 07 Jan 2009 16:57:35 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-26419 I sort of agree with you, which is why I predict core countries will eventually make the combustion of fossil fuels illegal on the entire globe. I think you will see the first signs of that around 2020 to 2030. I sort of agree with you, which is why I predict core countries will eventually make the combustion of fossil fuels illegal on the entire globe. I think you will see the first signs of that around 2020 to 2030.

]]> By: David B. Benson http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22196 David B. Benson Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:40:17 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22196 Karen --- That is CalTech professor David Rutledge's take on the matter. His post regarding peak coal is over on TheOilDrum. Karen — That is CalTech professor David Rutledge’s take on the matter. His post regarding peak coal is over on TheOilDrum.

]]> By: David B. Benson http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22195 David B. Benson Thu, 13 Nov 2008 22:39:26 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22195 Far, far better just to require 'retiring' as much (or more) CO2 as combustion of fossil fuels generates. Use, more example, enhanced mineral weatherization. Far, far better just to require ‘retiring’ as much (or more) CO2 as combustion of fossil fuels generates. Use, more example, enhanced mineral weatherization.

]]> By: JCH http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22188 JCH Thu, 13 Nov 2008 21:23:16 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22188 "No matter how much price you put on carbon, it will still be profitable to use fossil fuels. This is precisely because of the inertia that is built into our global market. Everything is tied to oil, natural gas and coal. We don’t have an infrastructure to run a non-fossil-fuel economy. ..." - vakibs I sort of agree with you, which is why I predict core countries will eventually make the combustion of fossil fuels illegal on the entire globe. I think you will see the first signs of that around 2020 to 2030. “No matter how much price you put on carbon, it will still be profitable to use fossil fuels. This is precisely because of the inertia that is built into our global market. Everything is tied to oil, natural gas and coal. We don’t have an infrastructure to run a non-fossil-fuel economy. …” – vakibs

I sort of agree with you, which is why I predict core countries will eventually make the combustion of fossil fuels illegal on the entire globe. I think you will see the first signs of that around 2020 to 2030.

]]> By: Joe http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22184 Joe Thu, 13 Nov 2008 20:49:01 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22184 Karen -- One guy's calculation is not much to go on. I actually think that the person who wrote that post doesn't really understand the latest IPCC analysis, particularly its discussion of feedbacks. I'd like to say I will get back to this, but the news is flying so fast and furious, I barely have time to respond to comments. Karen — One guy’s calculation is not much to go on.

I actually think that the person who wrote that post doesn’t really understand the latest IPCC analysis, particularly its discussion of feedbacks.

I’d like to say I will get back to this, but the news is flying so fast and furious, I barely have time to respond to comments.

]]> By: Karen http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22183 Karen Thu, 13 Nov 2008 20:44:36 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22183 Joe, on this subject, I'd be interested in reading your take (in all your free time ;-) ) on a new post in Nature's Climate Feedback blog, which claims there may not be enough fossil fuel to get us to an A1FI-type scenario (altho curiously they don't refer to A1FI but to A1G). I have not paid the $ to get the full IEA report but can't imagine it remotely syncs. http://blogs.nature.com/climatefeedback/2008/11/energy_vs_climate_a_surprising.html Thanks. Karen Joe, on this subject, I’d be interested in reading your take (in all your free time ;-) ) on a new post in Nature’s Climate Feedback blog, which claims there may not be enough fossil fuel to get us to an A1FI-type scenario (altho curiously they don’t refer to A1FI but to A1G). I have not paid the $ to get the full IEA report but can’t imagine it remotely syncs.

http://blogs.nature.com/ climatefeedback/ 2008/ 11/ energy_vs_climate_a_surprising.html

Thanks.
Karen

]]> By: vakibs http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22158 vakibs Thu, 13 Nov 2008 15:24:20 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22158 You cannot put a price on carbon. This is quite stupid, and suffers from circular thinking. All the global currencies are tied to energy prices. In effect, it is energy that is the true currency in our world (not US dollars). Energy prices are the true indicators of the health of the global market. No matter how much price you put on carbon, it will still be profitable to use fossil fuels. This is precisely because of the inertia that is built into our global market. Everything is tied to oil, natural gas and coal. We don't have an infrastructure to run a non-fossil-fuel economy. No price on carbon will guarantee the establishment of such an infrastructure. You cannot put a price on carbon. This is quite stupid, and suffers from circular thinking.

All the global currencies are tied to energy prices. In effect, it is energy that is the true currency in our world (not US dollars). Energy prices are the true indicators of the health of the global market.

No matter how much price you put on carbon, it will still be profitable to use fossil fuels. This is precisely because of the inertia that is built into our global market. Everything is tied to oil, natural gas and coal. We don’t have an infrastructure to run a non-fossil-fuel economy.

No price on carbon will guarantee the establishment of such an infrastructure.

]]> By: Larry Coleman http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22138 Larry Coleman Thu, 13 Nov 2008 05:28:45 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22138 Clearly, deniers like HH and Ray have no idea how they appear to anyone who understands the science. It would be revealing to see what they use as sources. It would be revealing to know what they understand science to be. Many (most?) deniers quote, e.g., Crichton as one of their talking points. This immediately tells us all we need to know about their cred. The irony is that, after politicizing the science of climate change, deniers complain that it is politicized and see even valid science as political partisanship. And they believe it. Clearly, deniers like HH and Ray have no idea how they appear to anyone who understands the science. It would be revealing to see what they use as sources. It would be revealing to know what they understand science to be. Many (most?) deniers quote, e.g., Crichton as one of their talking points. This immediately tells us all we need to know about their cred.

The irony is that, after politicizing the science of climate change, deniers complain that it is politicized and see even valid science as political partisanship. And they believe it.

]]> By: paulm http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22137 paulm Thu, 13 Nov 2008 05:07:59 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22137 "Anyone" with a bit of statistics and maths can use readily available temp data to find out what is happening.... <blockquote> Joseph http://www.blogger.com/profile/11536734331366279894 <b>Wherein I Revise Previous Sensitivity Estimate Down to 3.13C</b> http://residualanalysis.blogspot.com/2008/08/wherein-i-revise-previous-sensitivity.html I found an annual reconstruction of CO2 atmospheric concentrations that goes from 1832 to 1978. It is made available by CDIAC and it comes from Etheridge et al. (1998). ... This means that climate sensitivity to CO2 doubling (based on this model which only considers this one forcing) is most likely 3.13 degrees Celsius. .... </blockquote> “Anyone” with a bit of statistics and maths can use readily available temp data to find out what is happening….

Joseph
http://www.blogger.com/profile/11536734331366279894

Wherein I Revise Previous Sensitivity Estimate Down to 3.13C
http://residualanalysis.blogspot.com/ 2008/ 08/ wherein-i-revise-previous-sensitivity.html

I found an annual reconstruction of CO2 atmospheric concentrations that goes from 1832 to 1978. It is made available by CDIAC and it comes from Etheridge et al. (1998).
…
This means that climate sensitivity to CO2 doubling (based on this model which only considers this one forcing) is most likely 3.13 degrees Celsius.
….

]]> By: David B. Benson http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22117 David B. Benson Thu, 13 Nov 2008 01:10:38 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/11/12/must-read-iea-report-explains-what-must-be-done-to-avoid-6%c2%b0c-warming/#comment-22117 Ray --- Amazing! You have just contradicted 159 years of physics! You have discovered something which disagrees with every nation's academy of science (those that have such), every major scientific and engineering society; even the American Association of Petroleum Geologists! For various reasons, ClimateProgress is not the best blog to explain your astounding discovery. I suggest the OpenThread on http://tamino.wordpress.com/ I'll be watching there for your announcement! :-) Ray — Amazing! You have just contradicted 159 years of physics! You have discovered something which disagrees with every nation’s academy of science (those that have such), every major scientific and engineering society; even the American Association of Petroleum Geologists!

For various reasons, ClimateProgress is not the best blog to explain your astounding discovery. I suggest the OpenThread on

http://tamino.wordpress.com/

I’ll be watching there for your announcement! :-)

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