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	<title>Comments on: Scientist: &#8220;Our conclusions were misinterpreted&#8221; by Inhofe, CO2 &#8212; but not the sun &#8212; &#8220;is significantly correlated&#8221; with temperature since 1850</title>
	<atom:link href="http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/</link>
	<description>The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Sat, 21 Nov 2009 20:52:49 -0500</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Hank Roberts</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-29808</link>
		<dc:creator>Hank Roberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 14 Feb 2009 06:02:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-29808</guid>
		<description>&gt; Why someone like Morano would take notice of my little blog is beyond
&gt;  me but apparently he has nothing better to do.

They&#039;re running scared, and you have a good blog.  Lately I&#039;ve noticed that if I do searches for his postings, it leads to finding good climate blogs I didn&#039;t know about.

So they&#039;ve got either a good data mining program or a vast team of minions working.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&gt; Why someone like Morano would take notice of my little blog is beyond<br />
&gt;  me but apparently he has nothing better to do.</p>
<p>They&#8217;re running scared, and you have a good blog.  Lately I&#8217;ve noticed that if I do searches for his postings, it leads to finding good climate blogs I didn&#8217;t know about.</p>
<p>So they&#8217;ve got either a good data mining program or a vast team of minions working.</p>
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		<title>By: Wes</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-29180</link>
		<dc:creator>Wes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 05 Feb 2009 16:57:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-29180</guid>
		<description>Help me out....there is 3,000 to 3,600 billion tons of CO2 in our atmosphere.  Man puts out 27 billion tons each year or less than 1% of a very mobile CO2 cycle.  And we&#039;re less than 10,000 year out of a 100,000 year ice age cycle.  So I&#039;m not surprised if the average global temp rises slowly.  And I live on the slopes of Mauna Loa where the famed NOAA lab is and where the famed CO2 curve was measured...but its located close to an active volcano(Kilauea) where inversion layers bring CO2 up to the station.  How accurate is all this?  I was a research biochemist and now a physician on the island.  Aloha and Thanks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Help me out&#8230;.there is 3,000 to 3,600 billion tons of CO2 in our atmosphere.  Man puts out 27 billion tons each year or less than 1% of a very mobile CO2 cycle.  And we&#8217;re less than 10,000 year out of a 100,000 year ice age cycle.  So I&#8217;m not surprised if the average global temp rises slowly.  And I live on the slopes of Mauna Loa where the famed NOAA lab is and where the famed CO2 curve was measured&#8230;but its located close to an active volcano(Kilauea) where inversion layers bring CO2 up to the station.  How accurate is all this?  I was a research biochemist and now a physician on the island.  Aloha and Thanks</p>
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		<title>By: ScruffyDan</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-26902</link>
		<dc:creator>ScruffyDan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Jan 2009 07:17:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-26902</guid>
		<description>For reasons that I still don&#039;t understand Marc Morano, has decided to
spend his time closely watching my low traffic blog, and chime in when
I say such controversial things as &quot;our GHG emissions are responsible
for the recent warming trend&quot;. Why someone like Morano would take
notice of my little blog is beyond, me but apparently he has nothing
better to do.

See here for the relevant background:
http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1504
http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1521

I recently wrote a post on Morano/Inhofe&#039;s laughable list of over 650
scientists who dispute climate change, which included an excerpt of
this post and a post by Tim Lambert of Deltoid.

Well Morano has seen fit to respond to my post, and in doing so has
also responded to your and Tim Lambert&#039;s posts on the subject.  Given the
author of the response I am quite certain it is filled with half
truths twisted beyond any recognition and outright lies, but I haven&#039;t
yet taken a close look at it (hopefully I will be able to do so
tomorrow).

Anyways I just wanted to give you a heads up.

Here is my original post
http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1922
And here is Morano&#039;s reply:
http://co2sceptics.com/attachments/database/Morano%20responds%20to%20Romm__0__0__1231719513.pdf

Keep up the good work.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For reasons that I still don&#8217;t understand Marc Morano, has decided to<br />
spend his time closely watching my low traffic blog, and chime in when<br />
I say such controversial things as &#8220;our GHG emissions are responsible<br />
for the recent warming trend&#8221;. Why someone like Morano would take<br />
notice of my little blog is beyond, me but apparently he has nothing<br />
better to do.</p>
<p>See here for the relevant background:<br />
<a href="http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1504" rel="nofollow">http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1504</a><br />
<a href="http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1521" rel="nofollow">http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1521</a></p>
<p>I recently wrote a post on Morano/Inhofe&#8217;s laughable list of over 650<br />
scientists who dispute climate change, which included an excerpt of<br />
this post and a post by Tim Lambert of Deltoid.</p>
<p>Well Morano has seen fit to respond to my post, and in doing so has<br />
also responded to your and Tim Lambert&#8217;s posts on the subject.  Given the<br />
author of the response I am quite certain it is filled with half<br />
truths twisted beyond any recognition and outright lies, but I haven&#8217;t<br />
yet taken a close look at it (hopefully I will be able to do so<br />
tomorrow).</p>
<p>Anyways I just wanted to give you a heads up.</p>
<p>Here is my original post<br />
<a href="http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1922" rel="nofollow">http://www.scruffydan.com/blog/?p=1922</a><br />
And here is Morano&#8217;s reply:<br />
<a href="http://co2sceptics.com/attachments/database/Morano%20responds%20to%20Romm__0__0__1231719513.pdf" rel="nofollow">http://co2sceptics.com/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>attachments/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>database/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>Morano%20responds%20to%20Romm__0__0__1231719513.pdf</a></p>
<p>Keep up the good work.</p>
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		<title>By: Olympus Mons</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-25430</link>
		<dc:creator>Olympus Mons</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Dec 2008 15:30:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-25430</guid>
		<description>Guys,
being a sociologist, it&#039;s fascinating to browse trough all the related websites, pro and cons, and just try to evaluate attitudes an speech! – and I can assure you, compare to Skeptics websites … you all, it’s McCarthyism, it’s gulag frame of mind again. Fascinating, fascinating. Thanks for all the input I get from you guys. It’s it again, exactly the same, you are ready for the revolution! --- get the guns and let’s shut that deniers for good! – yeah, showtime!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Guys,<br />
being a sociologist, it&#8217;s fascinating to browse trough all the related websites, pro and cons, and just try to evaluate attitudes an speech! – and I can assure you, compare to Skeptics websites … you all, it’s McCarthyism, it’s gulag frame of mind again. Fascinating, fascinating. Thanks for all the input I get from you guys. It’s it again, exactly the same, you are ready for the revolution! &#8212; get the guns and let’s shut that deniers for good! – yeah, showtime!</p>
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		<title>By: Hank Roberts</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-25216</link>
		<dc:creator>Hank Roberts</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 19 Dec 2008 21:56:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-25216</guid>
		<description>To find it: go to AGU, search for     Altai Eichler
Pops right up.

http://www.googlesyndicatedsearch.com/u/agu1?hl=en&amp;ie=UTF-8&amp;oe=UTF-8&amp;q=Altai+Eichler&amp;btnG=Search

Eichler, A., S. Olivier, K. Henderson, A. Laube, J. Beer, T. Papina, H. W. Gäggeler, and M. Schwikowski (2008), Temperature response in the Altai region lags solar forcing,

Geophys. Res. Lett., doi:10.1029/2008GL035930, in press.

Go back and read the original post before claiming this supports your point of view, if you&#039;re coming into this late to copypaste.

[PDF] (accepted 5 December 2008)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>To find it: go to AGU, search for     Altai Eichler<br />
Pops right up.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.googlesyndicatedsearch.com/u/agu1?hl=en&amp;ie=UTF-8&amp;oe=UTF-8&amp;q=Altai+Eichler&amp;btnG=Search" rel="nofollow">http://www.googlesyndicatedsearch.com/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>u/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>agu1?hl=en&amp;ie=UTF-8&amp;oe=UTF-8&amp;q=Altai+Eichler&amp;btnG=Search</a></p>
<p>Eichler, A., S. Olivier, K. Henderson, A. Laube, J. Beer, T. Papina, H. W. Gäggeler, and M. Schwikowski (2008), Temperature response in the Altai region lags solar forcing,</p>
<p>Geophys. Res. Lett., doi:10.1029/2008GL035930, in press.</p>
<p>Go back and read the original post before claiming this supports your point of view, if you&#8217;re coming into this late to copypaste.</p>
<p>[PDF] (accepted 5 December 2008)</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Biggs</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24687</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Biggs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 15:06:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24687</guid>
		<description>Reality is winning out though, Australia just set a target of a 5% to 15% reduction in CO2 emissions by 2020 instead of the expected 25%, plus Poland, Italy and Germany have also gone cold on emissions reductions.

More green redundancies to come?

Philippe Varin, the chief executive of Corus, is threatening to shift the steelmaker&#039;s European operations to China unless regulations governing carbon emissions are overhauled. Mr Varin warned that politicians had to help fund new clean-energy technologies or face the prospect of Corus quitting the UK and Europe. Corus employs around 25,000 workers in the UK and is in negotiations with unions over pay in an effort to curb large redundancies.
      --Tricia Holly, The Independent on Sunday, 14 December 2008</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Reality is winning out though, Australia just set a target of a 5% to 15% reduction in CO2 emissions by 2020 instead of the expected 25%, plus Poland, Italy and Germany have also gone cold on emissions reductions.</p>
<p>More green redundancies to come?</p>
<p>Philippe Varin, the chief executive of Corus, is threatening to shift the steelmaker&#8217;s European operations to China unless regulations governing carbon emissions are overhauled. Mr Varin warned that politicians had to help fund new clean-energy technologies or face the prospect of Corus quitting the UK and Europe. Corus employs around 25,000 workers in the UK and is in negotiations with unions over pay in an effort to curb large redundancies.<br />
      &#8211;Tricia Holly, The Independent on Sunday, 14 December 2008</p>
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		<title>By: DavidONE</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24684</link>
		<dc:creator>DavidONE</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 14:15:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24684</guid>
		<description>Gotta love the tagline at Paul&#039;s Denier blog - &quot;Bridging the gap between reality and official science&quot;.

More like: &quot;Bridging the gap between what I really, really want to be true and official science&quot;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Gotta love the tagline at Paul&#8217;s Denier blog &#8211; &#8220;Bridging the gap between reality and official science&#8221;.</p>
<p>More like: &#8220;Bridging the gap between what I really, really want to be true and official science&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Biggs</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24676</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Biggs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 07:45:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24676</guid>
		<description>I don&#039;t understand your comments Dano - none of what you say is related to my post above - the Tsonis paper was published in 2007, and Eichler paper is in press.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t understand your comments Dano &#8211; none of what you say is related to my post above &#8211; the Tsonis paper was published in 2007, and Eichler paper is in press.</p>
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		<title>By: Dano</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24649</link>
		<dc:creator>Dano</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Dec 2008 01:34:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24649</guid>
		<description>Paul:

if this paper is as blockbuster as you advertise, you have a moral duty to ensure the author publishes it in a place where people read it. 

Go ahead and edit it and let us know when it gets published in a journal. Then we&#039;ll read it. Until then, who cares?

Best,

D</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Paul:</p>
<p>if this paper is as blockbuster as you advertise, you have a moral duty to ensure the author publishes it in a place where people read it. </p>
<p>Go ahead and edit it and let us know when it gets published in a journal. Then we&#8217;ll read it. Until then, who cares?</p>
<p>Best,</p>
<p>D</p>
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		<title>By: Paul Biggs</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24611</link>
		<dc:creator>Paul Biggs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Dec 2008 14:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/12/scientist-our-conclusions-were-misinterpreted-by-inhofe-co2-but-not-the-sun-is-significantly-correlated-with-temperature-since-1850/#comment-24611</guid>
		<description>I believe I was first to post this paper  - on my weblog &#039;Climate Research News.&#039;

Posted thus:

Solar Link to 50% of Warming During the Past 100 Years?

There is a new paper ‘in press’ in Geophysical Research Letters by Eichler et al entitled, ‘Temperature response in the Altai region lags solar forcing.’

The Abstract states:

The role of the sun on Earth’s climate variability is still much debated. Here we present an ice core oxygen isotope record from the continental Siberian Altai, serving as a high-resolution temperature proxy for the last 750 years. The strong correlation between reconstructed temperature and solar activity suggests solar forcing as a main driver for temperature variations during the period 1250-1850 in this region. The precisely dated record allowed for the identification of a 10-30 year lag between solar forcing and temperature response, underlining the importance of indirect sun-climate mechanisms involving ocean induced changes in atmospheric circulation. Solar contribution to temperature change became less important during industrial period 1850-2000 in the Altai region.

In the Results and Discussion the authors write:

“Our reconstructed temperatures are significantly correlated with the 10Be and 14C based solar activity reconstructions in the period 1250-1850, but not with the greenhouse gas CO2 (Figure 2b). This indicates that solar activity changes are a main driver for the temperature variation in the Altai region during the pre industrial time. However, during the industrial period (1850-2000) solar forcing became less important and only the CO2 concentrations show a significant correlation with the temperature record. Our results are in agreement with studies based on NH temperature reconstructions [Scafetta et al., 2007] revealing that only up to approximately 50% of the observed global warming in the last 100 years can be explained by the Sun.”

Whilst this paper supports studies by Scafetta et al, it is clear that solar factors are still poorly understood, and there are many factors other than CO2 or Solar involved in climate change. A correlation with post industrial CO2 does not necessarily imply causation. For example, Tsonis et al, 2007 investigated the collective behavior of known climate cycles such as the Pacific Decadal Oscillation, the North Atlantic Oscillation, the El Nino/Southern Oscillation, and the North Pacific Oscillation. By studying the last 100 years of these cycles’ patterns, they found that the systems synchronized several times. In cases where the synchronous state was followed by an increase in the coupling strength among the cycles, the synchronous state was destroyed. Then, a new climate state emerged, associated with global temperature changes and El Nino/Southern Oscillation variability. The suggestion is that this mechanism explains all global temperature tendency changes and El Nino variability in the 20th century. 

http://climateresearchnews.com/2008/12/solar-link-to-50-of-warming-during-the-past-100-years/

So the paper is very clear it what it says, although like all papers it has flaws and assumptions. The 10 to 30 year lag between solar forcing and temperature response is also interesting.

Not a paper that climate alarmists or realists should get too excited about!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I believe I was first to post this paper  &#8211; on my weblog &#8216;Climate Research News.&#8217;</p>
<p>Posted thus:</p>
<p>Solar Link to 50% of Warming During the Past 100 Years?</p>
<p>There is a new paper ‘in press’ in Geophysical Research Letters by Eichler et al entitled, ‘Temperature response in the Altai region lags solar forcing.’</p>
<p>The Abstract states:</p>
<p>The role of the sun on Earth’s climate variability is still much debated. Here we present an ice core oxygen isotope record from the continental Siberian Altai, serving as a high-resolution temperature proxy for the last 750 years. The strong correlation between reconstructed temperature and solar activity suggests solar forcing as a main driver for temperature variations during the period 1250-1850 in this region. The precisely dated record allowed for the identification of a 10-30 year lag between solar forcing and temperature response, underlining the importance of indirect sun-climate mechanisms involving ocean induced changes in atmospheric circulation. Solar contribution to temperature change became less important during industrial period 1850-2000 in the Altai region.</p>
<p>In the Results and Discussion the authors write:</p>
<p>“Our reconstructed temperatures are significantly correlated with the 10Be and 14C based solar activity reconstructions in the period 1250-1850, but not with the greenhouse gas CO2 (Figure 2b). This indicates that solar activity changes are a main driver for the temperature variation in the Altai region during the pre industrial time. However, during the industrial period (1850-2000) solar forcing became less important and only the CO2 concentrations show a significant correlation with the temperature record. Our results are in agreement with studies based on NH temperature reconstructions [Scafetta et al., 2007] revealing that only up to approximately 50% of the observed global warming in the last 100 years can be explained by the Sun.”</p>
<p>Whilst this paper supports studies by Scafetta et al, it is clear that solar factors are still poorly understood, and there are many factors other than CO2 or Solar involved in climate change. A correlation with post industrial CO2 does not necessarily imply causation. For example, Tsonis et al, 2007 investigated the collective behavior of known climate cycles such as the Pacific Decadal Oscillation, the North Atlantic Oscillation, the El Nino/Southern Oscillation, and the North Pacific Oscillation. By studying the last 100 years of these cycles’ patterns, they found that the systems synchronized several times. In cases where the synchronous state was followed by an increase in the coupling strength among the cycles, the synchronous state was destroyed. Then, a new climate state emerged, associated with global temperature changes and El Nino/Southern Oscillation variability. The suggestion is that this mechanism explains all global temperature tendency changes and El Nino variability in the 20th century. </p>
<p><a href="http://climateresearchnews.com/2008/12/solar-link-to-50-of-warming-during-the-past-100-years/" rel="nofollow">http://climateresearchnews.com/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>2008/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>12/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span>solar-link-to-50-of-warming-during-the-past-100-years/<span style="font-size: 1px;"> </span></a></p>
<p>So the paper is very clear it what it says, although like all papers it has flaws and assumptions. The 10 to 30 year lag between solar forcing and temperature response is also interesting.</p>
<p>Not a paper that climate alarmists or realists should get too excited about!</p>
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