Comments on: Hadley Center: “Catastrophic” 5-7°C warming by 2100 on current emissions path http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/ The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics Sat, 21 Nov 2009 13:19:38 -0500 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.5 hourly 1 By: Dan L. http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-83751 Dan L. Wed, 24 Jun 2009 20:37:31 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-83751 The mainstream media have mostly lost interest in climate issues. Even these catastrophic scenarios don't seem to move them to produce any special reports on the subject. I have seen and heard but a few brief mentions on the American tv networks. The right wing propaganda machine, on the other hand, is still in full song. Its American media stooges on Fox News, talk radio and myriad blogs are in non-stop misinformation delivery mode. Fake "climate conferences" are given breathless coverage; fake "experts" are given regular air time; wisecracking Fox (and other) news anchors smirk every day it snows somewhere in the U. S. A full scale propaganda struggle is underway, but only the rightists are truly dedicated to total war. James Hansen seems to be one of the few scientists who realize this. The mainstream media have mostly lost interest in climate issues. Even these catastrophic scenarios don’t seem to move them to produce any special reports on the subject. I have seen and heard but a few brief mentions on the American tv networks.

The right wing propaganda machine, on the other hand, is still in full song. Its American media stooges on Fox News, talk radio and myriad blogs are in non-stop misinformation delivery mode. Fake “climate conferences” are given breathless coverage; fake “experts” are given regular air time; wisecracking Fox (and other) news anchors smirk every day it snows somewhere in the U. S.

A full scale propaganda struggle is underway, but only the rightists are truly dedicated to total war. James Hansen seems to be one of the few scientists who realize this.

]]> By: Arnie http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-46621 Arnie Wed, 06 May 2009 00:55:39 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-46621 "It may be “a worst-case scenario” for rational people like her, but right now..." So this blog post was made by irrational people? Please explain what I've missed. American is my first language, English my second. “It may be “a worst-case scenario” for rational people like her, but right now…”

So this blog post was made by irrational people? Please explain what I’ve missed. American is my first language, English my second.

]]> By: Sky Modem http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-39965 Sky Modem Sat, 18 Apr 2009 03:49:46 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-39965 You may be right about "poor messaging by scientists (and environmentalists and progressives) and generally lame media coverage", I don't know for sure. But I know this: When I try to talk to others about Climate Change, their eyes glaze over. I think that people are so overwhelmed with the reality they face already that they just can't face the bad news, and they tune it out. Hell, I posted <a title="THIS" href="http://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-change/expanding-tropics-a-threat-to-millions-761326.html" rel="nofollow">THIS</a> in Reddit a while ago, and it got kicked to the curb within a minute. No big deal I guess, but I suspect that is what many I have talked to are doing mentally with this issue. It is hard for me to believe that so many are stuck in some kind of denial trance, but that seems to be what I'm seeing. You may be right about “poor messaging by scientists (and environmentalists and progressives) and generally lame media coverage”, I don’t know for sure.

But I know this: When I try to talk to others about Climate Change, their eyes glaze over. I think that people are so overwhelmed with the reality they face already that they just can’t face the bad news, and they tune it out. Hell, I posted THIS in Reddit a while ago, and it got kicked to the curb within a minute. No big deal I guess, but I suspect that is what many I have talked to are doing mentally with this issue.

It is hard for me to believe that so many are stuck in some kind of denial trance, but that seems to be what I’m seeing.

]]> By: RICHARD RALPH ROEHL http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-37326 RICHARD RALPH ROEHL Sun, 05 Apr 2009 19:32:44 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-37326 No doubt... THE DOCTRINE OF PERPETUAL GROWTH of the human population and the global economy on 'Planet Over-Birth Earth', a fragile HOST ORGANISM of limited space and limited resources, cannot be sustained. Perpetual growth is NOT progress! It is cancer! Full blown cancer... killing the planet body (Earth's ecosystem and the biosphere) that sustains humankind (a.k.a.: ewe-man-unkind). We are clever baboonies, but we're not very wise or prescient. And where there is no insight, the people perish! This is the price we shall all pay for stupidly clinging to outdated religious dogmas (a.k.a.: 'dogmess')... and indulging in arrogant, racist, bigoted tribe-all-eeego identities. The human family had better wake up and think bigger than a worthless buck... and gold bricks that ewe folks can't eat or drink. Furthermore... Mohammad-mad, Jesus (a..k.a.: Jeeezass!), L. Ron Hubbard and all the other prophets of profits will not be returning to save ewe folks (der 'sheeple people') from EXTINCTION! Yesss... Old Coyote Knose! Old Coyote Knose! No doubt… THE DOCTRINE OF PERPETUAL GROWTH of the human population and the global economy on ‘Planet Over-Birth Earth’, a fragile HOST ORGANISM of limited space and limited resources, cannot be sustained.

Perpetual growth is NOT progress! It is cancer! Full blown cancer… killing the planet body (Earth’s ecosystem and the biosphere) that sustains humankind (a.k.a.: ewe-man-unkind).

We are clever baboonies, but we’re not very wise or prescient. And where there is no insight, the people perish! This is the price we shall all pay for stupidly clinging to outdated religious dogmas (a.k.a.: ‘dogmess’)… and indulging in arrogant, racist, bigoted tribe-all-eeego identities.

The human family had better wake up and think bigger than a worthless buck… and gold bricks that ewe folks can’t eat or drink. Furthermore… Mohammad-mad, Jesus (a..k.a.: Jeeezass!), L. Ron Hubbard and all the other prophets of profits will not be returning to save ewe folks (der ’sheeple people’) from EXTINCTION!

Yesss… Old Coyote Knose! Old Coyote Knose!

]]> By: Anthony, rabid doomsayer http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-32096 Anthony, rabid doomsayer Wed, 11 Mar 2009 13:36:04 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-32096 And I called myself Doomsayer. This is getting very scary. And I called myself Doomsayer. This is getting very scary.

]]> By: Brad Arnold http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-32086 Brad Arnold Wed, 11 Mar 2009 05:47:39 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-32086 While I think there are many serious threats from elevated temperatures, the primary one is being overlooked: the routine failure of non-irrigated crops due to record high temperatures. Civilization began about 12K ago when the Younger Dryas ended and the Holocene began, because the climate allowed for humans to grow crops to support cities. "Few seem to realise that the present IPCC models predict almost unanimously that by 2040 the average summer in Europe will be as hot as the summer of 2003 when over 30,000 died from heat. By then we may cool ourselves with air conditioning and learn to live in a climate no worse than that of Baghdad now. But without extensive irrigation the plants will die and both farming and natural ecosystems will be replaced by scrub and desert. What will there be to eat? The same dire changes will affect the rest of the world and I can envisage Americans migrating into Canada and the Chinese into Siberia but there may be little food for any of them." --Dr James Lovelock's lecture to the Royal Society, 29 Oct. '07 By the way, for a taste of what is to come, witness what will happen in 2009 when global food production declines 20-40% due primarily to drought ( http://informationclearinghouse.info/article21955.htm ). "Food riots terrify the elites much more than energy riots. Marie Antoinette was beheaded because bread, not wood or20coal, was so scarce for the poor. The Roman Emperors provided free bread to a third of the population of Rome, not free wood, because they were very fearful of the hungry and jobless mob. For an increasing number of third world nations civil unrest, including violence, as a result of food deprivation is now the most significant threat to regime continuity." --Vinod K. Dar, Right Side News, 18 June 2008 While I think there are many serious threats from elevated temperatures, the primary one is being overlooked: the routine failure of non-irrigated crops due to record high temperatures. Civilization began about 12K ago when the Younger Dryas ended and the Holocene began, because the climate allowed for humans to grow crops to support cities.

“Few seem to realise that the present IPCC models predict almost unanimously that by 2040 the average summer in Europe will be as hot as the summer of 2003 when over 30,000 died from heat. By then we may cool ourselves with air conditioning and learn to live in a climate no worse than that of Baghdad now. But without extensive irrigation the plants will die and both farming and natural ecosystems will be replaced by scrub and desert. What will there be to eat? The same dire changes will affect the rest of the world and I can envisage Americans migrating into Canada and the Chinese into Siberia but there may be little food for any of them.” –Dr James Lovelock’s lecture to the Royal Society, 29 Oct. ‘07

By the way, for a taste of what is to come, witness what will happen in 2009 when global food production declines 20-40% due primarily to drought ( http://informationclearinghouse.info/article21955.htm ).

“Food riots terrify the elites much more than energy riots. Marie Antoinette was beheaded because bread, not wood or20coal, was so scarce for the poor. The Roman Emperors provided free bread to a third of the population of Rome, not free wood, because they were very fearful of the hungry and jobless mob. For an increasing number of third world nations civil unrest, including violence, as a result of food deprivation is now the most significant threat to regime continuity.” –Vinod K. Dar, Right Side News, 18 June 2008

]]> By: petB http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-31973 petB Tue, 10 Mar 2009 11:43:06 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-31973 I am just a physicist, so I do not have any insight into used models, but large positive feedback would point to highly unstable system, and climate is rather very stable system. I am just a physicist, so I do not have any insight into used models, but large positive feedback would point to highly unstable system, and climate is rather very stable system.

]]> By: Rodney Coenen http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-31749 Rodney Coenen Sun, 08 Mar 2009 23:16:45 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-31749 Hydrogen need not be 40 years away. Forget all that missing infrastructure for ground transportation and focus on air transport. A subsidized pilot demo of a LH2 fueled turbine on an airframe revised for cryogenic H will showcase the aircraft. New facilities at the airport for generating power from a renewable to hydrolize water and liquefy hydrogen gets you the fuel. Compare "well to wheel" for hydrogen made and used at the airport to Jet A kerosene fuel starting out as crude under the sand in the middle east. Air transport anaylists say the fuel weight to energy ratio of hydrogen is compelling, not to mention Jet A cost at next price rise, or climate change, or security, or stimulus. Hydrogen need not be 40 years away. Forget all that missing infrastructure for ground transportation and focus on air transport. A subsidized pilot demo of a LH2 fueled turbine on an airframe revised for cryogenic H will showcase the aircraft.

New facilities at the airport for generating power from a renewable to hydrolize water and liquefy hydrogen gets you the fuel. Compare “well to wheel” for hydrogen made and used at the airport to Jet A kerosene fuel starting out as crude under the sand in the middle east.

Air transport anaylists say the fuel weight to energy ratio of hydrogen is compelling, not to mention Jet A cost at next price rise, or climate change, or security, or stimulus.

]]> By: Gail http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-29299 Gail Sat, 07 Feb 2009 00:40:10 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-29299 We are clearly going to reach the worst case scenario predictions as nothing drastic is being done about this catastrophic issue. People fail to mention that the world population is growing exponentially and this urgently needs to be addressed in order to curb carbon dioxide emissions. It is time that political correctedness is set aside, in favour of realistic solutions if we are to save the human species. We need to stop reproducing at the rate at which we currently are, and prevent global world population from reaching 9 billion by 2050. If this becomes reality, we are on a direct path to human extinction. It is that simple. A global one-child policy should be implemented now. Of course, because of human rights, especially in the EU, this would never become a reality but this would be a pragmatic solution to this issue. Drastic consequences warrant drastic measures. Without addressing the population issue, we are only tackling the problem of climate change superficially and that is a waste of time - we might as well resign ourselves now to certain, imminent extinction. We need to tackle this issue from all angles. Everybody, wake up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Its now or never. Our human consciousness needs to be awakened. We are clearly going to reach the worst case scenario predictions as nothing drastic is being done about this catastrophic issue. People fail to mention that the world population is growing exponentially and this urgently needs to be addressed in order to curb carbon dioxide emissions. It is time that political correctedness is set aside, in favour of realistic solutions if we are to save the human species. We need to stop reproducing at the rate at which we currently are, and prevent global world population from reaching 9 billion by 2050. If this becomes reality, we are on a direct path to human extinction. It is that simple. A global one-child policy should be implemented now. Of course, because of human rights, especially in the EU, this would never become a reality but this would be a pragmatic solution to this issue. Drastic consequences warrant drastic measures. Without addressing the population issue, we are only tackling the problem of climate change superficially and that is a waste of time – we might as well resign ourselves now to certain, imminent extinction. We need to tackle this issue from all angles. Everybody, wake up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Its now or never. Our human consciousness needs to be awakened.

]]> By: paulm http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-27712 paulm Wed, 21 Jan 2009 17:30:34 +0000 http://climateprogress.org/2008/12/21/hadley-study-warns-of-catastrophic-5%c2%b0c-warming-by-2100-on-current-emissions-path/#comment-27712 Taking the "its always worse than predicted" (especially when it comes to climate predictions) rule in to account, I would shift the temperature column down one. We are probably in for a +3 deg rise in the best case scenario. And Hansen hints at this when he says we should aim for 350 or less! Its that 'or less' part which he does not clarify. Taking the “its always worse than predicted” (especially when it comes to climate predictions) rule in to account, I would shift the temperature column down one.

We are probably in for a +3 deg rise in the best case scenario. And Hansen hints at this when he says we should aim for 350 or less! Its that ‘or less’ part which he does not clarify.

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