Comments on: Rep. Shimkus: “Man will not destroy this Earth. This Earth will not be destroyed by a flood.” Rep. Barton: “I wish I had another dozen John Shimkuses on the committee.”

By: Will Greene

Will Greene — Sat, 02 May 2009 02:29:05 +0000

David Benson, it is interesting that a world with 3000 ppm CO2 had polar regions that led to the development of feathers in some dinosaurs. Of course if you consider the other dinosaurs, none of them developed fur or feathers which suggests a very hot planet. I would like to see a piece by Joe about the climate the dinosaurs lived in. Since the deniers always bring up the climate of the dinosaurs, I would like to know the truth on the subject. Really, the fact that sea level was 170 meters higher back then is enough to prove that the 3000ppm CO2 did have a considerable impact on climate.

By: David B. Benson

David B. Benson — Fri, 01 May 2009 22:23:30 +0000

Will Greene — Actually, some dinos lived in polar regions with six months of night; wasn’t green and lush there. It is hypothsized that feathers evolved to keep warm and giving us our only surviving descendants of the dinos: birds.

What will happen to modern climate, with the modern distribution of the continents, from excess CO2 is the expansion of the Hadley cells, causing the desert areas to move further north in the northern hemisphere and further south in the southern hemisphere. Since total percipitation will remain about the same or increase, it’ll be wetter in what remains of the temperate reegions, probably bad for agriculture there as well.

By: justus

justus — Fri, 01 May 2009 18:40:17 +0000

Joe, I respectfully suggest you’ve missed a great messaging lesson here – a potential future post? As for Shimkus – fish in a barrel. But one of the phrases/ ideas he latches onto provides a re-framing opportunity – to the benefit of the whole pro-future community (that’s the people who like life and civilization).

One of the principle messaging mistakes made by the old-school enviro community is this nonsense about ’saving the planet’ or ’saving the earth.’ So Shimkus is technically right – we will not destroy the earth. Nor will we ever ’save’ it. Maybe this seems like splitting hairs, but I think it’s important; I think we need to be clear about what’s at stake. Not something abstract like ‘the planet’ but something very specific – the health and future of most living things, including humans, and the very foundations of our civilization…

By: riverat

riverat — Fri, 01 May 2009 05:44:22 +0000

Carl,

If you build your monument be sure to site it above 250 feet in elevation. Estimated sea level if all of the Antarctic ice melts is 230-240 feet. Put it on a nice bluff that overlooks the (new) ocean.

Dave

By: Will Greene

Will Greene — Fri, 01 May 2009 02:08:19 +0000

I guess my question David Benson is, we all know that the dinosaur’s habitat in the Cretaceous period was generally forest, rivers, lush tropical rainforest (I’m just going off of every dinosaur documentary I’ve ever seen). If the ppm CO2 during this time was 3000-4000, wouldn’t we expect an arid, charred, desert habitat, that’s constantly flooded with torrential downpours and hot acidified deadzone oceans?

By: Bullwinkle

Bullwinkle — Fri, 01 May 2009 01:39:38 +0000

Thanks, Rick! Nice site, but even that top 10 list missed George “denim is evil” Will.

Carl, I still like the physical monument idea. Something future generations can throw eggs at and pee on.

By: David B. Benson

David B. Benson — Thu, 30 Apr 2009 22:53:05 +0000

“Deserts take up about one third of the Earth’s land surface.” from
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desert

By: Chris S

Chris S — Thu, 30 Apr 2009 21:09:58 +0000

If I were Rep. Shimkus’ pastor, I would be terribly ashamed by his misuse of Genesis. I would also take him to the other end of the book and remind him that there will be a time “for destroying the destroyers of the earth” (Revelation 11:18).

By: Will Greene

Will Greene — Thu, 30 Apr 2009 21:08:36 +0000

And I’m guessing temperatures were much, much higher in the Cretaceous period, am I right? My question for Dr. Romm or others that I’ve had for a while is, Dr. JR has said at 1000ppm 1/3rd of the planet will be desert. Was at least 1/3rd of the planet desert in the Cretaceous Period when CO2 ppm (as the ostriches in Congress often tell us) was at 3000-4000ppm? Anyone with knowledge on the dinosaurs should know this answer, thanks!

By: carl

carl — Thu, 30 Apr 2009 18:43:04 +0000

This wall of shame needs to be physical, something that the news media can use in a news report …. something that people can visit…something physical.

Not sure how you feel about this, but I think a HUGE mistake made in the reporting is that they use C rather than F when reporting temperature rise. Ditto on centimeters vs. feet. ……. most Americans don’t do the math and it looks smaller than it actual is.