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	<title>Comments on: Offsets gone wild:  Domino&#8217;s Certified Carbonfree Sugar!</title>
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	<description>The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics</description>
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		<title>By: david305</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-52636</link>
		<dc:creator>david305</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 May 2009 18:21:23 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-52636</guid>
		<description>Mencken, not Barnum, said, “No one in this world has ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses of the plain people. Nor has anyone ever lost public office thereby.” (Mencken also said, “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.”)

Many commentators have missed the point. Yes, we all know that sugar contains carbon. Domino is trying to seem “environmentally sensitive” because they burn their cane wastes for milling. It so happens that it saves them a fortune in electricity, and it’s what any smart sugar business does. The main deal in the “carbon-neutral” issue is really the fact that Domino, like any other big farmer, GROWS PLANTS. In that sense, they are indeed sequestering carbon, just like planting forests (or any crop) would do.
But all this is a cover. We in Florida know what degenerate polluters the sugar companies are. They use incredible quantities of fertilizer; poor management causes huge amounts of run-off, thus the eutrophication (choking) of our streams and lakes by algae and other water plants. It’s caused vast damage to the Everglades and other areas far beyond the sugar fields.
How can we tell? Upstream from sugar farms, the streams etc. are fine; downstream, they’re a slimy mess. You do the math. They’ve been told to either treat or recycle this run-off, but can’t be bothered to do it properly. (The state is paying a fortune to buy back fields from the sugar companies, just because of this polluted mess.)
So Domino is merely trying to look environmentally conscious, as a cover for the fact that they’re one of the biggest polluters — just not of smoke and CO2. (Oh, BTW, they still run all the tractors and reapers on diesel. Perhaps the sugar fields sequester as much carbon as the tractors emit, though that’s debatable.)

For those who buy the right-wing pap that “carbon dioxide is harmless” — Even leaving aside the greenhouse gas aspect, CO2 is our waste product, every time we exhale. And NO CREATURE CAN LIVE IN ITS OWN WASTES. By vastly overproducing our waste product, we make our globe a little less habitable every day. That panicky feeling you get when you hold your breath underwater for too long? It’s not from oxygen deprivation; it’s from carbon dioxide build-up.

Don’t believe me OR them, please. Do your own UNBIASED research.
Back to Mencken’s point: lots of folks say they’d sooner believe an ignorant dirt farmer than some professor. But as in all things, follow the money. If it’s gonna cost that dirt farmer more not to pollute, he won’t believe in pollution, even while his own family is choking from the smoke.
Without going overboard — when are we going to grow up as a species, and take responsibility for ourselves, look after one another, and clean up our messes before they get out of hand? So okay, don’t be an environmentalist. But please — be an adult.
Peace,
David</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Mencken, not Barnum, said, “No one in this world has ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses of the plain people. Nor has anyone ever lost public office thereby.” (Mencken also said, “Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard.”)</p>
<p>Many commentators have missed the point. Yes, we all know that sugar contains carbon. Domino is trying to seem “environmentally sensitive” because they burn their cane wastes for milling. It so happens that it saves them a fortune in electricity, and it’s what any smart sugar business does. The main deal in the “carbon-neutral” issue is really the fact that Domino, like any other big farmer, GROWS PLANTS. In that sense, they are indeed sequestering carbon, just like planting forests (or any crop) would do.<br />
But all this is a cover. We in Florida know what degenerate polluters the sugar companies are. They use incredible quantities of fertilizer; poor management causes huge amounts of run-off, thus the eutrophication (choking) of our streams and lakes by algae and other water plants. It’s caused vast damage to the Everglades and other areas far beyond the sugar fields.<br />
How can we tell? Upstream from sugar farms, the streams etc. are fine; downstream, they’re a slimy mess. You do the math. They’ve been told to either treat or recycle this run-off, but can’t be bothered to do it properly. (The state is paying a fortune to buy back fields from the sugar companies, just because of this polluted mess.)<br />
So Domino is merely trying to look environmentally conscious, as a cover for the fact that they’re one of the biggest polluters — just not of smoke and CO2. (Oh, BTW, they still run all the tractors and reapers on diesel. Perhaps the sugar fields sequester as much carbon as the tractors emit, though that’s debatable.)</p>
<p>For those who buy the right-wing pap that “carbon dioxide is harmless” — Even leaving aside the greenhouse gas aspect, CO2 is our waste product, every time we exhale. And NO CREATURE CAN LIVE IN ITS OWN WASTES. By vastly overproducing our waste product, we make our globe a little less habitable every day. That panicky feeling you get when you hold your breath underwater for too long? It’s not from oxygen deprivation; it’s from carbon dioxide build-up.</p>
<p>Don’t believe me OR them, please. Do your own UNBIASED research.<br />
Back to Mencken’s point: lots of folks say they’d sooner believe an ignorant dirt farmer than some professor. But as in all things, follow the money. If it’s gonna cost that dirt farmer more not to pollute, he won’t believe in pollution, even while his own family is choking from the smoke.<br />
Without going overboard — when are we going to grow up as a species, and take responsibility for ourselves, look after one another, and clean up our messes before they get out of hand? So okay, don’t be an environmentalist. But please — be an adult.<br />
Peace,<br />
David</p>
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		<title>By: Dave M</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-48641</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave M</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 May 2009 03:35:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-48641</guid>
		<description>How about carbon-free charcoal?  Or carbon-free Graphite?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>How about carbon-free charcoal?  Or carbon-free Graphite?</p>
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		<title>By: Susanna Murley</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-48348</link>
		<dc:creator>Susanna Murley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 08 May 2009 15:03:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-48348</guid>
		<description>Hey look Romm, Glen Beck agrees with you: http://mediamatters.org/clips/200905070015.

[&lt;em&gt;JR:  He is the classic broken clock!&lt;/em&gt;]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hey look Romm, Glen Beck agrees with you: <a href="http://mediamatters.org/clips/200905070015" rel="nofollow">http://mediamatters.org/clips/200905070015</a>.</p>
<p>[<em>JR:  He is the classic broken clock!</em>]</p>
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		<title>By: mom</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-47537</link>
		<dc:creator>mom</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 May 2009 09:31:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-47537</guid>
		<description>Who is Carbonfree.org and how do they determine their findings? Sugar production is the dirty little secret of Florida.  Domino Sugar is owned by US Sugar, a company that almost devasted the Everglades. In its attempt to write off the billions of dollars it owes Florida for the clean up effort, it is attempting to &quot;lease&quot; 500,000,000 acres to the state. For years US Sugar burned those acres to harvest the sugar, dropping ash from coast to coast, causing severe respiratory issuse for thousands of Floridians and polluting water systems . Once the sugar has been processed from the cane, the cane is sold and reprocessed.  Those cubic yards of fermented cane is then processed to extract chemicals that harden plastics. Is that also carbon free?  Who measures the methane created by the cane fermenting?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Who is Carbonfree.org and how do they determine their findings? Sugar production is the dirty little secret of Florida.  Domino Sugar is owned by US Sugar, a company that almost devasted the Everglades. In its attempt to write off the billions of dollars it owes Florida for the clean up effort, it is attempting to &#8220;lease&#8221; 500,000,000 acres to the state. For years US Sugar burned those acres to harvest the sugar, dropping ash from coast to coast, causing severe respiratory issuse for thousands of Floridians and polluting water systems . Once the sugar has been processed from the cane, the cane is sold and reprocessed.  Those cubic yards of fermented cane is then processed to extract chemicals that harden plastics. Is that also carbon free?  Who measures the methane created by the cane fermenting?</p>
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		<title>By: Tom ambler</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-46283</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom ambler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 05 May 2009 14:49:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-46283</guid>
		<description>Hi
I own an online retail store, www.exclusivelygreenmarket.com, that carries only &quot;green&quot; products. One thing that we did last year was partner with an offset company. They asked me to buy more offsets for this year but I didn&#039;t pay for them after reading what this site says about offsets. Can you please read what we are doing and give us tips as to how we can offset more of our shipping?

Thanks
Tom

1. In order to reduce the amount of traveling our products do we try to find American made products. This way we are supporting the American economy and the products don’t have to travel over the oceans to get to you.

2. We also try to find manufactures who will ship the products to you from their warehouse. Since we are based outside of Philadelphia this prevents products from having to be shipped multiple times around the country. For example: Lets say that something is made on the west coast. That product will have to be shipped from the west coast to the east coast. If someone on the west coast buys it we will then have to ship it back to the west coast. If the manufacturer ships it for us we can then just ship it from the warehouse on the west coast to another location on the west coast.

3. Any orders for inventory we have will be shipped via USPS. We feel this is the best way to ship the products. The USPS already has to go to every house six days a week. The other shipping companies will need to make special trips to deliver the order.

4. USPS also supplies boxes that are &quot;Cradle to Cradle&quot;SM Certification at the Silver level from MBDC (McDonough Braungart Design Chemistry) … Based on the recycled content of the more than 500 million Express Mail and Priority Mail packages and envelopes the Postal Service provides its customers each year, more than 15,000 metric tons of carbon equivalent emissions (climate change gases) now will be prevented annually. Express Mail and Priority Mail boxes and envelopes also are 100 percent recyclable.&quot; 

5. In the past we shipped most of our orders in the USPS boxes. Once we are through with our supply of USPS boxes we will do most of our shipping by using recycled boxes. When our inventory comes in we will reuse that box, but when we need more boxes we will work with other stores in the area that have extra boxes. This will save us having to use new boxes!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi<br />
I own an online retail store, <a href="http://www.exclusivelygreenmarket.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.exclusivelygreenmarket.com</a>, that carries only &#8220;green&#8221; products. One thing that we did last year was partner with an offset company. They asked me to buy more offsets for this year but I didn&#8217;t pay for them after reading what this site says about offsets. Can you please read what we are doing and give us tips as to how we can offset more of our shipping?</p>
<p>Thanks<br />
Tom</p>
<p>1. In order to reduce the amount of traveling our products do we try to find American made products. This way we are supporting the American economy and the products don’t have to travel over the oceans to get to you.</p>
<p>2. We also try to find manufactures who will ship the products to you from their warehouse. Since we are based outside of Philadelphia this prevents products from having to be shipped multiple times around the country. For example: Lets say that something is made on the west coast. That product will have to be shipped from the west coast to the east coast. If someone on the west coast buys it we will then have to ship it back to the west coast. If the manufacturer ships it for us we can then just ship it from the warehouse on the west coast to another location on the west coast.</p>
<p>3. Any orders for inventory we have will be shipped via USPS. We feel this is the best way to ship the products. The USPS already has to go to every house six days a week. The other shipping companies will need to make special trips to deliver the order.</p>
<p>4. USPS also supplies boxes that are &#8220;Cradle to Cradle&#8221;SM Certification at the Silver level from MBDC (McDonough Braungart Design Chemistry) … Based on the recycled content of the more than 500 million Express Mail and Priority Mail packages and envelopes the Postal Service provides its customers each year, more than 15,000 metric tons of carbon equivalent emissions (climate change gases) now will be prevented annually. Express Mail and Priority Mail boxes and envelopes also are 100 percent recyclable.&#8221; </p>
<p>5. In the past we shipped most of our orders in the USPS boxes. Once we are through with our supply of USPS boxes we will do most of our shipping by using recycled boxes. When our inventory comes in we will reuse that box, but when we need more boxes we will work with other stores in the area that have extra boxes. This will save us having to use new boxes!</p>
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		<title>By: Aaron</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-45790</link>
		<dc:creator>Aaron</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 17:19:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-45790</guid>
		<description>Although the whole &quot;carbon free&quot; sticker is not accurate, I applaud them for their efforts with using renewable energy sources. There aren&#039;t too many companies out their at the moment doing this, so I think we should be congratulating them, regardless of the semantics.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Although the whole &#8220;carbon free&#8221; sticker is not accurate, I applaud them for their efforts with using renewable energy sources. There aren&#8217;t too many companies out their at the moment doing this, so I think we should be congratulating them, regardless of the semantics.</p>
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		<title>By: Doug</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-45735</link>
		<dc:creator>Doug</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 14:14:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-45735</guid>
		<description>&lt;b&gt;Why would you need that much sugar on your pizza?&lt;/b&gt;

But seriously -- it looks like this company needs to just completely start over in the branding/marketing department...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><b>Why would you need that much sugar on your pizza?</b></p>
<p>But seriously &#8212; it looks like this company needs to just completely start over in the branding/marketing department&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Anne</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-45684</link>
		<dc:creator>Anne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 12:30:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-45684</guid>
		<description>wooops


www.revbilly.com

check him out....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>wooops</p>
<p><a href="http://www.revbilly.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.revbilly.com</a></p>
<p>check him out&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Anne</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-45682</link>
		<dc:creator>Anne</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 12:30:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-45682</guid>
		<description>This is just the tip of the iceberg.  

For a good while now, I have been a proponent of a strong labeling law, one with teeth, that requires certain products to disclose the CO2 emissions associated with manufacture, production, distribution, etc etc --- maybe the number can&#039;t be arrived at with total accuracy, but we could develop guidelines for estimating.    

The advertising rhetoric is just getting started on this stuff.   Before too long, no one will know anything about anything, as is pretty much the case now, about how hyoer- consumerism damages the planet.    My solution was to join the Church of Stop Shopping, and to adopt the Reverend Billy as my spiritual leader.    www.revbily.com  

p.s. he&#039;s running for Mayor of NYC.   Vote Rev Billy!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is just the tip of the iceberg.  </p>
<p>For a good while now, I have been a proponent of a strong labeling law, one with teeth, that requires certain products to disclose the CO2 emissions associated with manufacture, production, distribution, etc etc &#8212; maybe the number can&#8217;t be arrived at with total accuracy, but we could develop guidelines for estimating.    </p>
<p>The advertising rhetoric is just getting started on this stuff.   Before too long, no one will know anything about anything, as is pretty much the case now, about how hyoer- consumerism damages the planet.    My solution was to join the Church of Stop Shopping, and to adopt the Reverend Billy as my spiritual leader.    <a href="http://www.revbily.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.revbily.com</a>  </p>
<p>p.s. he&#8217;s running for Mayor of NYC.   Vote Rev Billy!</p>
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		<title>By: Karbon Kenny</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/05/03/domino-carbonfree-sugar-carbonfundor/#comment-45523</link>
		<dc:creator>Karbon Kenny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 04 May 2009 04:15:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=6260#comment-45523</guid>
		<description>Carbon free sugar. Funny. About as funny as someone actually paying for carbon offsets. Get all the carbon offsets you want. For free.

http://www.freecarbonoffsets.com

You will be happy you did.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Carbon free sugar. Funny. About as funny as someone actually paying for carbon offsets. Get all the carbon offsets you want. For free.</p>
<p><a href="http://www.freecarbonoffsets.com" rel="nofollow">http://www.freecarbonoffsets.com</a></p>
<p>You will be happy you did.</p>
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