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	<title>Comments on: Santer, Jones, and Schneider respond to CEI&#8217;s phony attack on the temperature record</title>
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	<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/</link>
	<description>The Latest on Climate Science, Solutions, and Politics</description>
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		<title>By: Mr. Language Person</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/#comment-164665</link>
		<dc:creator>Mr. Language Person</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Oct 2009 17:39:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=12726#comment-164665</guid>
		<description>Final[l]y, here&#039;s Jones:

[&lt;em&gt;JR:  Thanks.&lt;/em&gt;]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Final[l]y, here&#8217;s Jones:</p>
<p>[<em>JR:  Thanks.</em>]</p>
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		<title>By: Scott A. Mandia</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/#comment-162903</link>
		<dc:creator>Scott A. Mandia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Oct 2009 16:23:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=12726#comment-162903</guid>
		<description>What saddens me the most about stories such as this one is that many people seem to believe one or more of the following so they choose to ignore the current state of climate science:

1) The majority of scientists around the world are incompetent (they do not interpret data correctly, for example.)
2) The majority of scientists around the world are afraid to publish alternate viewpoints to an AGW-forced climate despite the fact that they would become famous if they could refute AGW.
3) The majority of scientists around the world are conspiring in order to secure funding.
4) The majority of scientists around the world are just using group speak which implies that they do not think for themselves.

Instead, there are a small handful of scientists that do not fit any of the above points, rarely, if ever, publish their findings in a respected journal, but are the ones that many in the public are listening to.

Seems to be a very foolish position to take.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What saddens me the most about stories such as this one is that many people seem to believe one or more of the following so they choose to ignore the current state of climate science:</p>
<p>1) The majority of scientists around the world are incompetent (they do not interpret data correctly, for example.)<br />
2) The majority of scientists around the world are afraid to publish alternate viewpoints to an AGW-forced climate despite the fact that they would become famous if they could refute AGW.<br />
3) The majority of scientists around the world are conspiring in order to secure funding.<br />
4) The majority of scientists around the world are just using group speak which implies that they do not think for themselves.</p>
<p>Instead, there are a small handful of scientists that do not fit any of the above points, rarely, if ever, publish their findings in a respected journal, but are the ones that many in the public are listening to.</p>
<p>Seems to be a very foolish position to take.</p>
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		<title>By: mike roddy</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/#comment-162900</link>
		<dc:creator>mike roddy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 17 Oct 2009 16:17:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=12726#comment-162900</guid>
		<description>I once said on Dot Earth that anyone who disputes the basic evidence of human caused climate change is either a fool, a liar, or a whore. That&#039;s how much their nonsensical posts were starting to aggravate me, especially since rational discussion never influences their views. They remind me of that statement, but I stand by it.

Scientists won&#039;t go that far, and are cautious and circumspect by nature. But it may be about time for scientists in the relevant fields to step up and stop providing any cover to the CEI and Limbaugh crowd by engaging in Socratic dialogues with them. They should collectively and forcefully call out the deniers for what they are, and make a special point of alerting the public on the issue.

Climate Cover Up, the new Hoggan book, does this quite well. And your pieces over the years on this subject have been the most courageous and factually accurate of anyone&#039;s, Joe, as the advancing science has proved. Thanks.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I once said on Dot Earth that anyone who disputes the basic evidence of human caused climate change is either a fool, a liar, or a whore. That&#8217;s how much their nonsensical posts were starting to aggravate me, especially since rational discussion never influences their views. They remind me of that statement, but I stand by it.</p>
<p>Scientists won&#8217;t go that far, and are cautious and circumspect by nature. But it may be about time for scientists in the relevant fields to step up and stop providing any cover to the CEI and Limbaugh crowd by engaging in Socratic dialogues with them. They should collectively and forcefully call out the deniers for what they are, and make a special point of alerting the public on the issue.</p>
<p>Climate Cover Up, the new Hoggan book, does this quite well. And your pieces over the years on this subject have been the most courageous and factually accurate of anyone&#8217;s, Joe, as the advancing science has proved. Thanks.</p>
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		<title>By: gmo</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/#comment-161590</link>
		<dc:creator>gmo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Oct 2009 18:06:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=12726#comment-161590</guid>
		<description>Indeed that is a most despicable false claim - destroying data and drawing conclusions from versions doctored to say something in particular.  Accusations like cherry-picking are not as toxic because they imply the data are still somewhere and can be analyzed by someone else.  But claiming that data have been destroyed and no longer exist in raw form is trying to lay groundwork to automatically dismiss anything.

We are well familiar with the debunked refrains of &quot;it warmed naturally in the past, so current warming cannot be known to be driven by humans.&quot;  Consider if that logic was being parroted with &quot;someone somewhere destroyed the raw data, so no data anywhere can be trusted.&quot;  I think all efforts must be undertaken to not allow that to seep in, and I applaud the pushback against as in the statements from the scientists above.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Indeed that is a most despicable false claim &#8211; destroying data and drawing conclusions from versions doctored to say something in particular.  Accusations like cherry-picking are not as toxic because they imply the data are still somewhere and can be analyzed by someone else.  But claiming that data have been destroyed and no longer exist in raw form is trying to lay groundwork to automatically dismiss anything.</p>
<p>We are well familiar with the debunked refrains of &#8220;it warmed naturally in the past, so current warming cannot be known to be driven by humans.&#8221;  Consider if that logic was being parroted with &#8220;someone somewhere destroyed the raw data, so no data anywhere can be trusted.&#8221;  I think all efforts must be undertaken to not allow that to seep in, and I applaud the pushback against as in the statements from the scientists above.</p>
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		<title>By: Rikki (Australia)</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/#comment-161137</link>
		<dc:creator>Rikki (Australia)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Oct 2009 10:41:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=12726#comment-161137</guid>
		<description>I absolutely agree with AlexJ (2). The scientific organizations have to call out these sort of denials in press releases and interviews. We do not have the time for our scientists to waste arguing this stuff. Just tell the public it is rubbish and get it over with.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I absolutely agree with AlexJ (2). The scientific organizations have to call out these sort of denials in press releases and interviews. We do not have the time for our scientists to waste arguing this stuff. Just tell the public it is rubbish and get it over with.</p>
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		<title>By: AlexJ</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/#comment-160686</link>
		<dc:creator>AlexJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Oct 2009 02:21:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=12726#comment-160686</guid>
		<description>That&#039;s the problem, Paul: They aren&#039;t being ignored, even by some of the more &quot;trusted&quot; media (apparently including the BBC). Presumably because they&#039;re a source of false &quot;balance&quot;, controversy and/or ideological convenience. And maybe sometimes because people don&#039;t have much clue about the past record of the key contrarians and obfuscators. Perhaps it&#039;s time for the scientific agencies to call out this nonsense in press releases, instead of just posting stuff on obscure web pages.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>That&#8217;s the problem, Paul: They aren&#8217;t being ignored, even by some of the more &#8220;trusted&#8221; media (apparently including the BBC). Presumably because they&#8217;re a source of false &#8220;balance&#8221;, controversy and/or ideological convenience. And maybe sometimes because people don&#8217;t have much clue about the past record of the key contrarians and obfuscators. Perhaps it&#8217;s time for the scientific agencies to call out this nonsense in press releases, instead of just posting stuff on obscure web pages.</p>
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		<title>By: paulm</title>
		<link>http://climateprogress.org/2009/10/15/phil-jones-ben-santer-stephen-schneider-respond-to-competitive-enterprise-institute-deniers/#comment-160379</link>
		<dc:creator>paulm</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 15 Oct 2009 22:39:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://climateprogress.org/?p=12726#comment-160379</guid>
		<description>I think we are almost at the point were we can ignore the deniers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think we are almost at the point were we can ignore the deniers.</p>
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